Rational Depression

[JoleneZachari]

I think I know why I feel the way I do, about life & living. Life is a series of 'goodbye' after 'goodbye's. That is because they don't value what's really important in life. Money is everything in the west, & that is (just) a fatal flaw with capitalism , & the ultimate reason why all of them will, nay, must fail, & fail horribly. This 'life' is a prison, death being the only guaranteed path to freedom from this poisoned thinking, & the powers that be have their heads so far up their asses, that they think they are right & everyone else is wrong, while social activities utterly destroy the planet & all futures for everything on earth. Humans are a story of a now failed species. It is possible, in our lifetime, that intergalactic-aliens have been, & are visiting earth. I'd like them to explain that, they MADE US, OUR SPECIES, to win a bar bet. That's the reason we exist, for no reason other than to win a stupid bet. And they are entertained, amused, shocked, appalled, horrified, & transfixed on our clownish antics, which to them is nothing more than a deposition of abusive apes in an ant farm on steroids. I hope they realise that humans are NOT going to survive if left to their own devices. Insanity has flourished in our human societies & we are basically all of us so paranoid that we'll rather have everyone die, lest someone derive an advantage or get the drop on someone else. Superior hunters (or hunting methodology) will dominate, until they realise hunting is cheating slow deliberate evolution, & ends in a self-terminating knot. Think about it, hunters are nothing without prey, & without prey, there are no hunters. We need to stop being parasites, taxing, damaging & ultimately destroying our earth & everything. Humans are the disease, I hope the aliens 👽 have an answer that doesn't involve wiping us out, but who could blame them for wiping humans out as a noxious & destructive weed species.

[Appleblossom]

 Durer "Melancholia"

Hearing you about some of the problems in modern society @JoleneZachari I agree with limiting consumerism and finding deeper values.

I do not think of it as the west tho.  In my city, the west is where the poorer people live.  My country is in the southern hemisphere, and quite a lot of sea and ocean lies between us and the Americas, Europe, Africa and Asia and even the Pacific.  A lot depends on how we use words, and sometimes opening up the mindset helps a little...

[Historylover]

It is sad indeed that our life experiences take us down this dark path, @JoleneZachari, and bring us to these conclusions. I have withdrawn from the rat race as much as possible myself, but the more I read of toxic workplaces and relationships, the more I am glad of it.

I once remarked to my ex-psy that the skyscrapers seemed to represent the stack of lives that have been damaged and lost in man's pursuit to one-up others and glorify himself.

There does seem to be only right and wrong, and right is always belonging to others. There is little room for discussion and wider consideration, and there is just so much talk and little corrective action. And too little consideration of the longer-term consequences of those actions that are taken. There is too little honest competition of ideas; some are allowed to win and others must fail to accommodate them. Favouritism and status quo win out. 

To be honest, I am finding sites like this give opportunity for sensible thinking more than actual face-to-face conversation. There just doesn't seem to be time for it out there. Perhaps no-one wants to make waves, think more deeply or challenge the status quo?

I like your bar bet suggestion. Here's hoping for a brighter tomorrow, heh?

[Messylife]

I hear you.
We are so miserable a species. We should look at otters. Otters love life, they look like they do anyway.
I bet they don't sweat the small stuff.

[Messylife]

Totally agree. We don't seem to use our words enough. There seems someone always has to get personal and make challenges into personal failures and faults of character. Passion seems dead. Morals are out of hand and social etiquette is lost. I like that this forum is supporting and non judgemental. We all seem to acknowledge that we don't always get life right. Here we are in the thick of it and we are not happy.

[scruffypuffball]

@JoleneZachari  you are not wrong, our society is making us sick.  Gabor Mate argues depression and anxiety are social constructs.

Gabor Mate covers this in his books, here is an interview

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HF7BONxLCs

I love the work of Dr Nate Hagens, he gives some options as to what the solutions are.  This is a very nuanced presentation, he leaves no stone unturned.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hNi-7EjsH4

More info on the psychology of a sick society:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljTePuCnXzY

In a recent interview Gabor Mate talked about how to survive in a sick society and he quoted Maslow.  He said Maslow said people who survive sick societies go against the culture rather than align with it.  Maslow found self actualised people are disconnected from the (corrupt) culture.  They found their own meaning.  They were healthy but disconnected from the unhealthy culture rather than disconnect with yourself.  You detach from the culture or didnt identify with its values (or lack of values), they insisted in their own meaning or interpretation of what is important, not dictated by the culture.

For another perspective, there is the book by David Graeber and David Wengrow "The Dawn of Everything" which argues humans were not always destructive.  That this is a recent maladaptive phenomenon.

[scruffypuffball]

"I once remarked to my ex-psy that the skyscrapers seemed to represent the stack of lives that have been damaged and lost in man's pursuit to one-up others and glorify himself."

Wow what a quote @Historylover can I steal that?  In your last paragraph you are right, a broken system requires self examination in order to transform.  The power structure actively prohibits self examination, lest it creates awareness of the issues, for the issues (and power structure) to be challenged.  As Chris Hedges said "power is a poison".  It does not concede without a fight.  It is just that this time around it is industrualised, globalised and difficult to neutralise.

[tyme]

I hear what you are saying @scruffypuffball . 

While if may be true for some, we cannot generalise that all therapists etc are the same. 

I think it is important we balance these viewpoints out so as not to discourage those who are looking for support.

[scruffypuffball]

@tymewhat Maslow meant was you detach from the corrupt culture, like a boundary.  It is mentioned here in the posts, if you are being abused in a family, you detach from it, limit your interactions - that is called a boundary.  It does not mean you detach and isolate yourself and not seek help or connect with like minded people with the same morals as you - it was not meant that way.  Is that what you mean?

I grew up in a toxic family.  What I found was humans do not connect via racial lines, or biological (blood) lines, but on neurological lines (ie shared values).  Isnt that what we are doing on this forum?

I would hate to think my posts discourage people from reaching out.  Let me know if they need to be deleted.  I am new to this, no hard feelings 🙂

[Historylover]

You're welcome to use my statement of truth, @scruffypuffball, and thank you for the high praise! 

I haven't kept up with this thread, but will read your extensive post soon. It looks like an interesting read.