Friends, Family & Carers Forum

[MimiandMoon]

Hello. I am new here and looking for some advice. It's a long post but I'd really appreciate if you'd read and share your thoughts.

One of my oldest childhood friends - we'll call her Moira -  has dealt with severe anxiety and depression since we were little girls. To the point where I was the only person she'd talk to, through most of our school years. We are now both 22 years old (over a decade of friendship), and I'm still, essentially the only friend she has. 

For a few years, now, I feel as if I've been playacting the role of friend. Every day, she seems to slip further and further into her mental illness, and frankly I think a lot of it is often enabled by her family members. As little children, it was made clear to everyone around her and her mother that we weren't to talk about anything that could upset Moira. This often led to all of us around her praising her hugely for every little accomplishment, keeping conversations very surface level, and giving into whatever she wanted. As a child, I accepted this and Moira readily. As an adult, now, though, I'm uneasy.

Frankly, I don't think it's the mental illness that is so much of a problem as the behavior Moira has now come to expect from all of us, and her mother demands. Moira has moved to a different city, where she has no job and does not attend school, but has her mother pay for her expensive studio apartment. Her current boyfriend is a drug dealer (not making this up). She refuses to move home, even though every two weeks or so she has a crisis that forces her mother - who's struggling financially - to buy a last minute plane ticket to go help her out. Which, I guess, is not my problem, that's her mother's choice. But today really hit a nerve.

Moira was in town for the holidays, and I was invited to her family's home to decorate Christmas cookies. And it was unlike anything I'd ever seen. She was so incredibly rude to her family members, making little insults that she would pass off as jokes, as everyone else around her was working hard. She yelled at her grandmother for using up the red food coloring that she wanted, and couldn't let it go. She kept insulting the grandmother, who said nothing, but simply left the room, to go take a nap on her own. When the grandmother was sleeping, she went to smear frosting on her face as a punishment. The adults in the room looked the other way, barely saying anything at all. I was the only one who told her no, that she was being mean and vindictive, but she did it any way. And when, soon after, she decided she was bored of frosting cookies her mother jumped and quickly packed us all up to take us home. 

I've made a lot of excuses over the past ten years. I've been understanding. I've listened. I've complied. But I feel like I'm being asked to participate in utter insanity, and turn a blind eye to behavior that is only partially driven by anxiety, but mostly driven by being spoiled. I'm feeling a need to cut ties with her, but am scared, as I'm the only friend she really has, and worrying that I'm not being understanding ENOUGH. Any thoughts? Thank you if you've read this whole thing.

[Former-Member]

Hi @MimiandMoon

And welcome to Sane. You are right - your friends behaviour is from being spoilt and from getting away with bad behaviour. Anxiety and depression is no excuse for the behaviour you described. Her mother really needs to cut off financial support for not only her own benefit, but that of her daughter's. Your friend has made her bed and needs to learn to stand on her own two feet to mature into a better and more stable person. The more the mother continues to support the daughter's questionable lifestyle - she is enabling it and her bad behaviour.  I had to do this with my own daughter and she has really turned her life around and we are now closer than ever. So I have had personal experience.

As for what you are personally willing to tolerate and accept in a friendship, has to be your decision and yours alone. Me personally, I would not support or associate with someone who displayed such utter disrespect to family or others after it being pointed out clearly only to be ignored. To me that could enable that behaviour. That's me though. From what you have posted you have been more than understanding. Your friend's behaviour is what is and will drive others away and only she can decide to change that. Wishing you all the best

[Laurana]

Hi @MimiandMoon,

It sounds like you already know that this 'Moira' is not truly a friend but using you and her family in a very negative way, psychologically and financially, to basically behave as rudely as she likes. Her mother and other relatives are enabling her in what seems a very self-centered lifestyle and ideally they would withdraw the financial support and set some firm boundaries with her about what behaviour they will tolerate and what they won't.

You wrote that as a child you tolerated the situation but now feel a need to cut ties with her yet you're her only friend and worry over this is holding you back from ending the relationship.

Frankly, anxiety and/or depression is no excuse for the behaviour you've described and you need to look at how much of a friendship you really have with this woman. You have been involved with her since childhood and she's now an adult whose every whim has apparently been catered to which has created a very selfish, demanding and manipulative woman. It's highly unlikely that she understands what friendship means and I doubt she understands the negative impact she's having on others around her, let alone cares.

Personally I would cut ties with this person: I've gone through a similar situation with a woman who was a 'friend' in the final years of high school and by the time I'd finished my Uni degree and was expecting a baby with my husband, it was very evident that she was not a friend, that she'd be very unlikely to change for the better, and that I needed to end the draining relationship for the sake of my own sanity and well being. I felt nothing but relief afterwards. No, in my case the woman wasn't as toxic as this Moira you've described but she was brought up to have rudeness and selfishness rewarded by her mother and I became fed up with making excuses for her to others and with feeling so drained after any time in her company.

You need to decide for yourself whether continuing to be around her is worth the cost to you. In regards to you being her only friend do bear in mind that it's not really a genuine friendship and she's definitely got her mother and other relatives in her life (who unfortunately continue to enable her toxic behaviour). Keep in mind too that if you do end the relationship it's highly unlikely that she will go to pieces as you might fear - but if you continue as you are just what is the cost to you?

This is ultimately a decision that only you can make but I think you'll be much better off ending the relationship. There are some very good books about friendships which can aid you in such a decision and I'd recommend the classic "When I Say No I Feel Guilty" - it helped me learn to set boundaries with others and overcome being a people pleaser, something you might feel you're liable to be with this Moira if not also with others. Wishing you all the best,
Laura (also new here!).

[Appleblossom]

To me it sounds as if you do not really want to befriend her any more.  Maybe space is the right thing.  Maybe her behaviours are far too ingrained to easily change.  Friendship needs to go both ways.  We also sometimes take on similar attitudes to the people we hang out with, so it can be a good idea to separate given you dont like what you see.  Its hard when we really do want to do the right thing.

[Faith-and-Hope]

Hi @MimiandMoon ......

My situation, without going into detail, has turned up at least one personality disorder within our family network.

If you look up personality disorders and begin listing the behaviours associated with your friend, I think you will find it very enlightening.  This goes beyond spoilt behaviour .....

Depression and anxiety, and social anxiety, lack of personal friendships, emotionally abusive, demanding and manipulative behaviour, self-centredness and lack of compassion / empathy for others is all part of the landscape for some of these ..... you haven’t described the “chameleon effect” of being able to turn on the charm and lure and manipulate that way, which would exclude NPD, but take a look at OCPD, Antisocial PD, Histrionic PD, BPD and perhaps NPD for comparison.

Your friend, if she has a personality disorder, didn’t ask for that to happen to her, so that is a mh challenge like any other that impairs your life .... but this type of disorder is extremely resistant to even being identified, much less treated.

If you choose to remain in a friendship with her I would advise you to consider placing strict and strong boundaries on it, in terms of what you are prepared to accept or not, such as asking to leave, or withdrawing at least, in response to the way she treated her grandmother.  If you are feeling uncommitted to the friendship, if she takes offense to your stand and shuts you out of her life, you are clearly no worse off.

 In fact, it is often the loss of significant relationships that is one of the few catalysts that drives people who are challenged in life this way to seek treatment and support to make changes they need to make in order to be able to have meaningful relationships, so you could be doing her a favour.

I hope this helps.